Openness, Scripture and More
Dec.16, 2010 in
Podcast Episodes
True to form, Ray and Steve have trouble staying on any one topic, but instead wax very passionately about several different topics, at least related in their own minds! 😉 Bouncing off comments made with regard to open theology a few episodes ago, this episode offers several thoughts that may cause mixed responses in the minds of some listeners. However, through it all, Ray and Steve continue to assert that they do not have all the answers, and that they are open to other ideas different from their own.
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December 17th, 2010 at 1:30 pm
I heard it said wednesday night that evangelism as it is known now says something along the lines of Repent now and be saved from the damnation of hell. The speaker related that to asking someone to choose between a red sucker and a blue sucker, but if you pick the blue sucker I will blow your head off. You choose salvation as a matter of salvation in that scenario. You guys seem to be moving more towards an inclusionary doctrine. And whlie that “lable” might hold significance that may be negative or have some deeper theological meaning that I don’t know I would have to say Jesus had a doctrine of inclusion – “come unto me all the children….”
December 17th, 2010 at 1:31 pm
Sorry – I meant you choose salvation as a matter of survival in that scenario.
December 17th, 2010 at 10:13 pm
Hi Big C,
You said:
You guys seem to be moving more towards an inclusionary doctrine. And whlie that “lable” might hold significance that may be negative or have some deeper theological meaning that I don’t know I would have to say Jesus had a doctrine of inclusion – “come unto me all the children….”
Speaking for myself (of course), I wouldn’t say that I believe in universalim or universal salvation, but I would agree that my view of salvation has definitely expanded and is more inclusive now than ever. In my mind, I still have to leave room for the free will of man and this is what keeps me from embracing ultimate reconciliation in Christ. If we really are free then this must include the real possibility of rejecting as well as embracing Christ, and therefore salvation for “there is no other name given by which we must be saved”. What do you think Big C?
December 18th, 2010 at 11:51 am
You mentioned about that you seem to talk about the same stuff over and over. I think that is true of all of us, but as a legitimate part of the process. Each time, we are in a different place in our lives and bring different experiences to the conversation. Also, having the conversation can change or add to our understanding as we bounce the ideas off of each other. I think sometimes we get the freshest insights because the Spirit quietly points and we go, “Oh! Look at that cool rabbit trail.”
December 19th, 2010 at 12:46 am
With my above thought in mind, as well as what you discussed…
Thinking about classical theology, if that is what you want to call it – let’s say the viewpoint where God micromanages my life. There was a time that I had gotten my life so off track, I wanted those clear boundaries. I wanted God’s boundaries, though, not artificial boundaries set by “leaders.”
So much of walking this out is learning to hear His voice in a noisy, demanding world. Supposedly, the “authority” of scripture is supposed to be the plumb line. However, it really doesn’t take that much study of history to make one wonder about how this text came to us, what was put in, what was left out and why. I really have read quite a bit on this subject, and it is wonderful what has been preserved, as you talked about in the podcast. At the same time, some of those early letters and sayings that were being passed around were suppressed in the early middle ages by the church in Rome because their authority was being undermined.
Most disputed are the “Gnostic Gospels” which are really strange reading. It is understandable why most of them were left out. But I have to wonder, if these had been included and been part of the familiar literature, would it have changed how “the church” does business? I’m not sure it would, because people are the same, seeking power and recognition and playing little social/political games.
September 26th, 2011 at 11:08 pm
I listen to beyond the box sometimes. I like the show a lot though I do not follow every episode. It is good that Ray and Steve admit they don’t have all answers.
July 31st, 2012 at 4:12 am
“True to form, Ray and Steve have trouble staying on any one topic, but instead wax very passionately about several different topics, at least related in their own minds”
And this is why I love listening to their podcast.